Prop Thrust and Pitch – What do they do?

It doesn’t matter if you fly RC airplanes or drive RC boats. These vehicles use a propeller ( prop ) and both are affected by each term, Prop Thrust and Prop Pitch Speed.

When referring to prop thrust and pitch speed, they both contribute to propeller performance. To be effective, a prop must deliver an adequate amount of thrust and pitch speed. Let’s look at what defines each term.

Propeller Pitch and Thrust

Propeller Pitch and Thrust

Prop Thrust Definition

Propeller Thrust is defined by the amount of force the prop can create along the axis of rotation. This force is directly translated in to the motion of an RC boat or plane. Thrust is a function of the size, rotational speed and pitch of the prop.

Prop Pitch Definition

Propeller Pitch is defined as the  distance that the propeller would move forward during one full rotation of the blades through its travel medium.  The value of pitch is typically provided in inches or millimeters and assumes no slip.  Pitch is increased on a propeller by increasing the angle of attack of the propeller blades.

Prop Pitch vs Prop Thrust – What do I Require?

Prop thrust is required for any application in order for the motor / prop combination to do work. This is also true for prop pitch.  In order to select a propeller for your application you would need to understand what your application is designed for to begin.

An airplane or boat that is designed to travel at slower speeds, would benefit from a propeller that delivers a high amount of thrust. Pitch speeds for a slow moving RC vehicle is not as critical. At the other end of the spectrum, if you have an RC boat or airplane that travels fast, pitch is quite important.

In general, fast moving vehicles have a smaller amount of drag than slower moving vehicles. This natural  marvel makes it much more simple for us to select the best propeller combination.

Prop Thrust is generally created from maximizing the diameter of the propeller. Pitch does contribute to thrust, however diameter more efficiently creates thrust.

Selecting the Correct Propeller Pitch

Let’s set an example that our RC Airplane should travel at a speed of 120 km/h. If we know the general speed of the RC airplane we can then select an appropriate pitch value. In order for our airplane to hit 120 km/h, the pitch speeds of the propeller must exceed 120 km/h. If we can not exceed 120 km/h in pitch, it is certain that our RC vehicle will not be capable of hitting 120 km/h. The primary reason for this is that there will always be slip in a prop. The slip will not allow us to attain the pitch speeds of a propeller. You can visit the RC Airplane Calculator page in order to calculate pitch speeds of a propeller.

Selecting the Correct Diameter Propeller

The next step as a continuation of the above example is to select the diameter of our prop. In order to accomplish this we must know one significant point in propeller selection relating diameter and pitch of a prop. A high angle of attack can make the propeller stall, becoming less effective at lower speeds. For an airplane this starts to happen when our diameter to pitch ratio starts to get smaller than 1.25:1. As you decrease the diameter/pitch ratio, the propeller performs poorly at low speeds. This scenario is not ideal when low speeds are an absolute requirement.

With this said, we can select an appropriate propeller diameter that will allow us to hit our thrust goals. Increasing the diameter of the propeller will increase the thrust potential of the prop while decreasing the diameter will decrease the thrust potential of the prop.

Prop Thrust and Pitch Summary

In conclusion, both thrust and pitch are very important. Thrust is required in order to overtake the amount of drag that is produced by the RC airplane or boat. However that thrust has to be made at the speed in which the vehicle would be travelling at.  This is where pitch speeds of the propeller is critical. Be certain to select a propeller combination that has enough pitch speed to achieve the speed goal of the application. A proper balance of both will produce the results that you are looking for!

Similar Story for Electric and Gas Jets

In this video we look at the differences of Static Thrust, Jet Efflux and how both of these relate to dynamic thrust.

How to extend ESC wires correctly

Extending ESC wires can harm the ESC if not done correctly. We explained the sort of phenomenon that is responsible for the troubles. That can be found here in an article titled, “Why extending ESC wires can be harmful.”  Bottom line is that the inductance of the battery input wires can destroy your ESC. You can either extend the motor to ESC wires or you can follow what is below.

How to extend ESC wires on the Battery Input Side

It is possible to extend the ESC wires by adding in a few components near the ESC. The component you must use are capacitors. Capacitors are used in parallel on the ESC battery input wires. These capacitors are best positioned as close as possible to the ESC. They are wired directly across the positive and negative terminals of the ESC in one location.                                                                                                                                                                                                      Affiliate Link to Castle Creations Capacitor Bank

It is important to not distribute them along the length of the ESC to battery wires. Doing so will not provide any benefit to the system. In addition, placing the capacitors close to the battery will not be efficient as the battery acts as a much larger capacitor. The inertia in the form of current gets worse as you move down the wires towards the ESC.

What Size and how many Capacitors are required

The capacitors that you will require are to be low ESR( Equivalent Series Resistance) and low impedance. These capacitors tend to be cylindrical in shape and because of this are commonly known for being cylindrical capacitors.

Cylindrical capacitors are polarity sensitive. When you wire them up, be certain that you know which terminal is positive and which is negative. Wiring capacitors to the wrong polarity will certainly cause failure.

The voltage of the capacitor must be higher than that of the maximum voltage of the battery. It is best to also have some head room here as the pulses generated from operation can actually increase the voltage load (higher than the max battery voltage) of the capacitors. Having capacitors that are much higher in voltage is no problem.

The amount of capacitance that you must add when extending ESC wires are 460uf for every 100mm or 4 inches of wire. Keep in mind this is one run of wire and does not represent a double run of wire.

Example of how to Extend ESC Wires

How to Solder Capacitor Bank to Extend ESC Wires

How to Solder Capacitor Bank to Extend ESC Wires

In the example above, the capacitor bank is soldered at the positive and negative terminal posts to the ESC wires. The battery wires to the ESC have been extended by 4 inches. In order to compensate a 460uf capacitor must be used. It doesn’t matter if you require one capacitor or three capacitors to get to 460uf or more. You can place capacitors in parallel to add up to the sufficient amount.

Extending Wires from ESC to Motor

There is no problem extending the wires on the motor side. No risk to the motor or ESC is taken. The worst thing that can happen is possible interference from these longer wire runs. In order to combat the interference, 3 twists per inch of the 3 wires leading to the motor with help.

Why extending ESC wires can be harmful

Did you know that extending the wires on your ESC can actually be harmful for your ESC? Yep, it’s true, extending wires on the battery side of the ESC can put a lot more stress on your ESC. This is for brushless motors.

Cutting ESC Wires - Water Hammer Effect

Cutting ESC Wires – Water Hammer Effect

Why extending wires can be harmful?

Extending your battery wires are only harmful on the battery input side of the ESC. The battery is the source of power that feeds the ESC current at a specific voltage. The ESC is responsible for sending the correct pulses of current to the brushless motor. In order to accomplish this, the ESC must be in sync with the exact rotational position of the motor. When the correct winding position matches up with the correct pole of the permanent magnet on the motors rotor, the ESC sends a pulse of current that allows the motor to rotate to the next position where this process repeats.

During this process the current that is passed by the ESC turns on for a split second and then shuts off for a split second. This repeating process is continuous as long as the motor is on. Now imagine the power coming from the battery rushing toward the motor and then all of a sudden it is shut off. We can think of a similar situation occurring with water within our own homes.

The water hammer effect

The water hammer effect is what many would more recognize within your own home. Take the same approach as we just covered but apply it to your faucet at home. Or even another high volume water valve. When you run the water at maximum velocity through one of these valves and then rapidly shut that valve as quickly as you can, you are inducing the water hammer effect within the pipes that feed that faucet or valve. Depending on a number of different factors within this plumbing in your home, you may very well hear a “hammer” type sound within the pipes.

We hear this hammer type sound as the water is forced to come to a complete stop. Upon coming to a complete stop, a shock wave is produced that ends up travelling back down the pipes.

This type of effect can be very damaging. Especially in areas where there is a very high volume of fluid travelling in pipes and abrupt changes. Although a water hammer in the home can be damaging if it is bad enough, water hammers throughout the house usually don’t cause catastrophic damage.  Either way, you don’t want them.

Water hammer in our ESC

The exact same thing happens within our ESC’s. This ripple effect caused within the wires of the ESC on the battery side, must be dampened in order for proper ESC function. You can see large capacitors on the input side of every brushless ESC. The job of these large capacitors is to smooth out the different pulses that exist in the main input circuit. These capacitors can be seen in the image above. Just the tips of the capacitors are outside of the heat shrink.

However, even large capacitors have a maximum capacity. If these capacitors are pushed hard they eventually can fail. If these capacitors fail, your ESC is destined to fail.

You never want this to happen. If it does, you are left with an ESC that can’t even be used as a paper weight since it will be burnt to a crisp.

Can you safely extend wires on an ESC?

The quick answer is yes. You can increase the length of wire between the ESC and motor quite easily with nothing special added. However, extending the length of the wires from the ESC input side to the batteries is possible but takes a bit of effort to complete successfully and safely. We will cover this in another article.

Best C Rating for RC LiPo Battery

Selecting the correct LiPo battery pack for your RC vehicle is not as easy as just selecting the cell count. One of the most important parts of the correct battery pack selection is also considering the C rating. What is the C rating? Well let’s take a look!

What is the C Rating?

All LiPo battery packs have a C rating associated with them. Actually, they have not just one C rating, but a few C ratings that we will discuss shortly. A C rating is a value given to the LiPo battery pack that refers to the maximum discharge rate of the LiPo.  Examples of C ratings could be anything between 30C to 65C. Numbers outside of this range are possible as well. LiPo’s typically have the C rating marked right on the front of the LiPo pack. Can you spot the rating on these packs?

2X 4s 4000mAh with a C Rating of 45C

2X 4s 4000mAh with a C Rating of 45C

 

How to calculate Max Discharge using the  C Rating?

The maximum discharge rate of the LiPo is highly dependent on the capacity of the battery pack. In general the larger the battery pack in terms of capacity measured in mAh, the higher theoretical maximum continuous discharge rate you should expect. With this being said, the capacity of the battery pack is part of the calculation. We first take the capacity of the battery pack in mAh and convert this to Ah. Next we use the maximum continuous discharge rating in order to perform the calculation. Take these two values and multiply them together.

If we look at the image above consisting of a 4000mAh 4s pack, it has a C rating of 45C. Firstly, 4000mAh is converted to 4Ah. We then take 4Ah and multiply it by 45C. The resulting value is 180 Amps.

4Ah x 45C = 180Amps

Our Turnigy Graphene pack is capable of providing 180A continuously according to the rating provided by the manufacture.

Check out this page to help calculate battery pack specifications.

Other C Ratings of a LiPo Battery Pack

There are other C ratings that can be found on LiPo battery packs that aren’t typically spoken about. The second C rating that is also quite important, is the rating provided for charging a LiPo battery. This C rating is specifically for the rate at which you can charge the battery pack at.

Charge Rate C rating

There are many chargers on the market these days that are able to charge at a high charge rate, significantly decreasing the amount of charge time. In order to be certain you can charge your pack quickly, you must verify the charge rate using the charge rate C rating.  When LiPo’s first came out, typical charge rates were known as 1C. Typical C ratings for charging in today’s day is anywhere from 2C to 15C where 15C charge rates are crazy!

The Turnigy Graphene pack in the above example has a charge rate of 10C. To determine the maximum charge rate, we first convert the pack capacity to Ah from mAh. 4000mAh is equal to 4Ah. Next we multiply this value by the charging C rating. 10C x 4Ah = 40 Amps maximum charge rate.  Keep in mind that this is an extremely high charge rate, in fact I typically do not charge any faster than 3C. An absolute personal maximum is 5C.

Peak Discharge C rating

The last and final C rating that you may come across when looking at LiPo battery packs, is the C rating for maximum peak discharge rate. The peak rating may or may not appear on the battery advertised. Typical peak ratings could be anywhere between 50 to 100% more than the rating for maximum continuous discharge.

What C rating is required for my Application?

The correct answer here really boils down to budgets, battery pack weights/sizing and required discharge rate. Having the battery pack with the highest C rating is always best for the power system and battery pack health.

It is best to have a discharge rate overhead of 30%. If you work out a maximum power system discharge of 100 amps. Your battery pack should should deliver at least 30% more or 130 total amps. Never match system draw to maximum continuous discharge rates of the battery pack.

2s 860mAh with a C Rating of 35C

2s 860mAh with a C Rating of 35C

For example, I would select this 860mAh at 35C for a load that will discharge at a maximum continuous current of 23 Amps.

35C x 0.86Ah = 30 Amps
30 Amps / ( 1 + 30%) = 30 A / 1.3
23 Amps

Having a battery pack that can deliver 1000 Amps for a motor that will only use 10 Amps may seem like overkill, and it probably is. However, there is no reason for concern that the battery pack could over power the motor. Keep in mind that a load only pulls the amount of current that it requires.

In conclusion, the best C rating for your pack is a value that will allow 30% overhead in discharge rate, fits your budget, and is the correct size and weight for your application.

How to determine when a LiPo Battery is DEAD

It’s known that like most things in life, LiPo batteries do not last forever. Eventually, LiPo batteries degrade to a point which makes them become unusable for your application.  The real question is, how do you know when an RC LiPo Battery is DEAD? Did you know that using a dead battery can actually be dangerous and could lead to catastrophic failure of the battery pack? A dead battery pack can also place extra strain on your ESC due to higher ripple voltages. If you are looking for more information on LiPo batteries it is recommended to check our LiPo batteries page.

Visual Inspection – When a LiPo Battery is DEAD

The most obvious way to determine if a LiPo battery is dead is to visually inspect it. What you are looking for when you are inspecting your LiPo battery pack is any sort of ballooning of the pack itself. A ballooning pack is caused when gases are released inside of the LiPo battery. Gases being released from a cell in a LiPo battery can happen for a number of reasons.

Generally, excessive heat is a contributor to packs that enlarge or balloon. If this happens to you during charging you must dispose of the pack immediately. You should dispose of the pack if this does happen at any time during use or no use. Ballooned LiPo battery packs can be very dangerous. 

How do you know a LiPo Battery is Dead?

How do you know a LiPo Battery is Dead?

Performance Test – When a LiPo Battery is DEAD

One of the easiest ways to determine if a LiPo battery pack is dead, is to review it’s performance characteristics.  This can be done by  placing the LiPo battery in the application that you intent to run the battery pack in. There are a few things to watch out for that would suggest your battery is around or past is expiry date. Let’s take a look.

Aggressive Run – Dead LiPo Test

The performance test  is quite simple and does not require much preparation other than a fully charged battery pack. What you will want to do is fully charge the battery and then place this in to your most power hungry vehicle that would of course use that battery pack.  You must be experienced running this vehicle to ensure that there are no power system concerns and everything has ran well before.

Run the battery pack more aggressively than you typically would. If your flying an airplane or driving a boat, maintain a higher average throttle setting than you typically would. If you are running an RC car accelerate more aggressively and frequently than you typically would. Keep in mind that if you are basing your run off a timer and you are driving more aggressively, you will burn more power. Don’t forget to consider this when setting your run time “timer.”

Only discharge the pack down to a maximum of 20%. Do not over discharge the pack as this won’t help or make your test any more conservative.

Once you have run your RC vehicle, these three items is what you should look for.

  1. Are you getting the expected performance out of your battery for the entire duration of your run?
  2. During the duration of the run, were there no low voltage cutoffs during the run?
  3. Is your battery operating at less than 60 degrees celcius or 140 degrees farenheit? (Dangerous if not)

If you have answered yes to these questions above, your pack is in fair condition. If you have answered no to any of the above questions, this could be a sign that your battery pack is in poor condition.

Looking at the Numbers – When a LiPo Battery is DEAD

If you have a more advanced charger, you may be able to use the information it offers to help you out. Take a look at your LiPo charger and see if it is possible for it to measure internal resistance often abbreviated IR. The unit of measurement is commonly in milli-ohms. (m Ω)

To use the resistance value determined by our charger, we first need to start with a discharged battery and use the charge function. Or you may start with a fully charged battery and use the discharge function. Discharging a pack to get a resistance reading is only recommended if your charger can discharge a significant amount of power.

It’s highly recommended to use the resistance determined by the charger during a charge cycle as you will be charging the battery regularly presumably. It’s also best to know the internal resistance of your packs cells when you purchased them new.  Determine the internal resistance  by charging your LiPo batteries and recording the internal resistance computed by your charger.

Measuring RC LiPo cell internal resistance (IR)

Measuring RC LiPo cell internal resistance (IR)

Once you have charged your pack and record the internal resistance you can determine the health of the cells in your LiPo battery pack. Generally speaking, if the resistance goes up by 2-3 times the original amount, your LiPo cells are suffering in performance. Depending on the application these packs are used in, 2-3 times the internal resistance may make them completely useless.

If you don’t know the internal resistance per cell of your LiPo pack when purchased new, here is a quick reference chart. Keep in mind these values are general values.

 

C Rating Capacity (mAh) IR per Cell (m Ω)
30 850 20
30 5000 2.9
45 2200 6.5
45 2200 2.6
65 1200 9.2
65 5000 1.9

Conclusion – When a LiPo Battery is DEAD

The method I typically use is actually a combination of the above.  If I’m happy using a half dead LiPo in an application that allows it, even with the weaker performance / capacity, then so be it.  As long as the LiPo is not in a dangerous state.When I can no longer use the LiPo battery pack, it is disposed of accordingly and a replacement is purchased.